Building an AR Puppy

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    Charlie Foxtrot
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Sat Jul 19, 2014 1:02 am

    http://lagniappeslair.blogspot.com/2014/07/a-day-at-bench.html

    A kind of light-weight article on reloading the .300. However, in the attached photo of his guns, you'll note he's very visibly marked his mags as being for the .300. Safety first.
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    Devereaux
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Sat Jul 19, 2014 1:40 am

    Very interesting thought, CF. Perhaps I ought to consider buying some MagPul mags, to use just for 300. They are clearly different from what I have otherwise.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Sat Jul 19, 2014 11:16 am

    Yah, anything to keep the .300 Murphy out of 5.56 rifles.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Sun Jul 20, 2014 4:07 pm

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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:19 pm

    Won't let me see the post, CF.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:38 pm

    Aw, carp. I think Blogger auto-updated and changed the URL.

    Here's the post: http://notonemoregunlaw.blogspot.com/2014/07/the-300-murphy-blk-irish.html
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:26 pm

    OK. The risk is there. But the risk is there for any number of similar situations. Lord knows, there have been any number of blown up weapons because of wrong ammo.

    What this says is that if you have a 300BLK you have to be extra special careful about your ammo. More than anything else, you have to keep 5.56 and 300 separate. IF you do that, you will be OK.

    If you want to add something to this, make your 300 mags different. But in my case, since I will only be using this for range and hunting, a couple P-mags would solve this issue. AND I don't think I will be having all that much of the 300 ammo hanging about.

    Think about it, you have "issues" with all KINDS of things in shooting. eg. ?Ever loaded a .45 Colt with smokeless. You load max loads, it STILL hardly covers the bottom. So it is REALLY EASY to double or even triple load a case. Talk about a bad day. But while it is a potential risk, it doesn't mean you stop reloading.

    Like everything in shooting, be careful.
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    Cornmastah
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:28 pm

    Hmmmmmm... well, I have now typed up 3 different posts to respond to this and have deleted them all after rereading them. Maybe I guess I will just say that my chainsaw and my lawn mower take different kinds of fuel. One is mixed gas the other is plain gas. You can put either type of gas into either machine. If you put the wrong type in, it will mess it up. I guess my .223/300 blk guns are the same to me. I 'could' put the wrong type of ammo in it, but I don't--because I know which one goes in which. I use the same mags for both, but have not had an incident yet, and don't think I ever will. I just know which ammo goes into which gun and I never get confused by it. I am, however, very careful when I take other people shooting and make sure I load the mags with the right ammo for them.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:35 pm

    I guess the biggest risk is to let OTHER PEOPLE load your mags. They may not be familiar with the difference in calibres.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:38 pm

    This kind of reminds me once I grabbed a canister of .308 military and took my M14 to the range. But when I got there, it was obvious the ammo was .30-'06. So I didn't try to load it or use it. You could say the same for the other way around.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Tue Jul 22, 2014 12:49 pm

    Tru dat, Dev and Corn. Good thoughts.

    I was unsure that post reflected a real concern, my innate ability to screw up by the numbers, or simple chicken-littling.

    If I get a 300 BLK, I think I'd: 1) Chose a bullet with a pronounced forward ogive, 2) Reload with a strong crimp, 3) Dedicate 300 BLK only mags, 4) Label and/or partially paint the mags and mag feed lips 5) Paint a device on the 300 Mags that is continued on the 300 BLK rifles magwell and upper, 6) Segregate the 5.56 and 300 equipment and time at the range completely, 7) Light a St. Murphy votive candle.

    I'm really considering a 300 BLK for it's flexibility and suitability for self-defense.

    From my systems management education, I know that the words "I'll be careful" are right up there with "Hold my beer and watch this!" Smile
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Tue Jul 22, 2014 3:13 pm

    One other thing, CF. The 300BLK round is noticeably different from a 5.56 - at least to an experienced shooter. I could see this issue with someone who is unfamiliar with weapons, and isn't paying attention.

    But as I said, this can happen with any number of rounds. And ALL reloading. My 20 Tactical is another possible mess-up. But I find the rounds different.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:40 pm

    Devereaux wrote:One other thing, CF. The 300BLK round is noticeably different from a 5.56 - at least to an experienced shooter. I could see this issue with someone who is unfamiliar with weapons, and isn't paying attention.

    But as I said, this can happen with any number of rounds. And ALL reloading. My 20 Tactical is another possible mess-up. But I find the rounds different.

    I agree with Dev, I just find the two rounds noticeably different. But I could see how this could be a problem for a less experienced shooter, or someone who is a little forgetful, etc...



    I have a few of the same types of platforms that shoot similar but different ammo, so I have always had to be aware of what ammo is going in which gun. I have AR's that shoot 5.56, 5.45x39, and 300 blk and AK's that are chambered for the same as well as 7.62x39. To me, 5.45 and 5.56 are still very different looking but are more similar to each other than 300 blk and 5.56.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:46 pm

    Now I am super curious as to if one of my normal .300 blk loads will allow the action and bolt to close enough to fire in a .223 AR. I might have to do a dummy round and see if I get enough bullet setback for that to happen or if my crimp is strong enough to stop it.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:38 am

    Yep, Dev, poorly worded. I tried to incorporate an element of an accident report: guy looked at rounds in the mag and said yup, .223. They weren't. KaBoomed on the first shot.    

    I hadn't heard of other calibers having this same problem. Except for one guy at our LGS who complained bitterly about the accuracy of his rifle. He had been told that .25-06 was a good hunting load, so he had tried it in his new .30-06.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:48 am

    Oh, Lordy! The ranks are filled with horror stories about the wrong ammo in a rifle. I was putting away my stuff at an outdoor range and saw a couple obvious newbies messing with their rifle behind the line. I went over to help and found they had a "stuck round". But with a little judicious work it came out - ruptured! I then asked to see their empties and found them ALL bulged on one side. I asked what calibre they were shooting, and they said they had bought this rifle from a store in Chicago and the guy there had sold them these reloads and said they would shoot fine. The reloads were .308. Have NO IDEA what the rifle was, as it was one of those turn-of-the-century military rifles from Europe. Probably an 8mm, but who knows.

    One of the clubs I shoot at has a rifle in a case wherein someone put the wrong calibre in it and blew the barrel most dramatically.

    This stuff happens all the time. Mostly it takes being careful about what you load into what. My 20 Tactical shoots a .223 case, but in .204. I shoot ONLY the Hornady 33gr red plastic tip bullet. There is not a lot of difference between .204 and .223, but there IS a difference. And there is actually a HUGE difference between a .308 and a .223. Just because the case length is the same, and the bolt face the same, it hardly means the ROUNDS are the same.

    So I would say this is basically a tempest in a teapot. Yes, there is the possibility of an error, but it isn't overwhelming. And certainly not like the article seems to imply. IT'S view seems to be that we're all a bunch of idiots. Mebbe, but I'll still fall on the side of the experienced shooter. Newbie - maybe an issue.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Wed Jul 23, 2014 12:14 pm

    My main argument is that I don't think that the possibility of chambering the wrong round should prevent you from buying a gun and enjoying the 300 blk cartridge. 5.56 and .300 blk can and should coexist in someone's personal collection. CF, you should get one! Smile
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Charlie Foxtrot on Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:47 pm

    Yeah, i should. The round has too many advantages.

    I just have to figure out how to avoid picking the BCG out of my forehead. I'm blonde - and I WILL screw it up.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:08 pm

    Curiosity got the better of me and I tested a few of my rounds to see if they would 'chamber' in the wrong gun. They didn't... here are a few pics.


    Round not chambering


    Bullet setback
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:50 am

    Cornmastah wrote:Got the cases and they look pretty good.  Going to load some up this weekend and test them out on monday morning.

    Finally got around to testing those loads. I shot about 100 of them and they all cycled fine. I didn't do accuracy comparisons with that brass vs my converted brass--just tested functionality. They shot well enough to bang steel at 100-200 yards just fine. The main reason for that shooting trip was to test that CZ rifle and also some new 6.5 creedmoor loads I had been working on for my Savage LRP.
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    Devereaux
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Sun Aug 03, 2014 2:45 pm

    Thank you, Corn.

    BTW, ?when do you get time to work. You look too young to be retired.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:42 pm

    Ha ha... Sometimes I have to work odd hours at night to do system upgrades and maintenance. My boss is very fair and will give me comp time off--which makes for extra shooting days.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:46 pm

    So I went and ordered 1k of the cases. We will see when they get here. If the pics are any indication, they ought to be downright gorgeous.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Cornmastah on Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:33 pm

    I need to order another 500... I have thought about maybe sending him my brass and paying for the conversion (to save time and because I have so much .223 brass). whenever I visit my family in washington, I get to bring back lots of free brass.
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    Re: Building an AR Puppy

    Post by Devereaux on Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:40 pm

    I'm not in your league on 5.5 brass. Slowly collecting mine. But I still have a bunch to shoot, so I should be good for a supply.

    Be interesting if he would give you a discount of some sort if you sent brass. ?Is your headstamped any particular one.

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